In a world of short-form content, it's important to engage with long-form ideas. Book Overflow is a podcast created for software engineers, by software engineers to discuss the best technical books in the world. Join co-hosts Carter Morgan and Nathan Toups each week as they discuss a new technical book! New episodes every Monday!
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High-Leverage Thinking for Engineers - Thinking in Systems by Donella Meadows
This week Carter and Nathan read Donella Meadows’ Thinking in Systems. A foundational primer on systems thinking, the book explores how stocks, flows, feedback loops, and leverage points shape everything from ecosystems to organizations. Join them as they discuss how systems thinking applies to software engineering, the hidden structures behind burnout and tech debt, and how to make high-leverage changes in complex systems.-- Books Mentioned in this Episode --Note: As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.----------------------------------------------------------Thinking in Systems by Donella H. Meadows https://amzn.to/4cMB35k (paid link)Tidy First?: A Personal Exercise in Empirical Software Design by Kent Beck https://amzn.to/3RoB9pR (paid link)Refactoring: Improving the Design of Existing Code by Martin Fowlerhttps://amzn.to/43Wqk5Q (paid link)Fundamentals of Software Architecture: An Engineering Approach by Mark Richards and Neal Fordhttps://amzn.to/3Y7CNjk (paid link)One Nation Under Blackmail, Vol. 1: The Sordid Union Between Intelligence and Crime that Gave Rise to Jeffrey Epstein by Whitney Alyse Webbhttps://amzn.to/3RsMt4f (paid link)Slow Productivity: The Lost Art of Accomplishment Without Burnout by Cal Newporthttps://amzn.to/3EH8MAe (paid link)The Software Engineer's Guidebook: Navigating Senior, Tech Lead, and Staff Engineer Positions at Tech Companies and Startups by Gergely Oroszhttps://amzn.to/3ExwPSa (paid link)What Is ChatGPT Doing ... and Why Does It Work? by Stephen Wolfram https://amzn.to/4iuSUim (paid link)----------------00:00 Intro 01:41 About the Book03:43 Thoughts on the Book08:07 Covering the Foundations and Defining Terms16:36 Feedback loops22:31 Overconfidence and why models lead us astray.35:56 Paradigms and Framing49:30 Leverage Points01:02:04 Final Thoughts----------------Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5kj6DLCEWR5nHShlSYJI5LApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/book-overflow/id1745257325X: https://x.com/bookoverflowpodCarter on X: https://x.com/cartermorganNathan's Functionally Imperative: www.functionallyimperative.com----------------Book Overflow is a podcast for software engineers, by software engineers dedicated to improving our craft by reading the best technical books in the world. Join Carter Morgan and Nathan Toups as they read and discuss a new technical book each week!The full book schedule and links to every major podcast player can be found at https://www.bookoverflow.io
Balancing Features and Systems Improvements - The Good News Factory by Kent Beck
This week Carter and Nathan read the Kent Beck's The Good News Factory. A sequel to Tidy First?, The Good News Factory explores the economics of software and instructs tech executives on how to produce teams that are constantly delivering good news. Join them as they discuss balancing feature development and systems improvment, the economic incentives of software, and more!-- Books Mentioned in this Episode --Note: As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.--------------------------------------------------------------------------00:00 Intro12:23 About the Book14:08 Thoughts on the Book16:24 Features, Structure, Coupling, and Cohesion33:13 Responding to Organizational Changes42:12 3X: Explore, Expand, and Extract56:54 Final Thoughts----------------Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5kj6DLCEWR5nHShlSYJI5LApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/book-overflow/id1745257325X: https://x.com/bookoverflowpodCarter on X: https://x.com/cartermorganNathan's Functionally Imperative: www.functionallyimperative.com----------------Book Overflow is a podcast for software engineers, by software engineers dedicated to improving our craft by reading the best technical books in the world. Join Carter Morgan and Nathan Toups as they read and discuss a new technical book each week!The full book schedule and links to every major podcast player can be found at https://www.bookoverflow.io
John Ousterhout and Robert "Uncle Bob" Martin Discuss Their Software Philosophies
Following up on their recent discussion on software design (inspired by Book Overflow!), John Ousterhout and Robert "Uncle Bob" Martin join Carter and Nathan for their first ever joint interview! Join them as they discuss what it was like working together, how the discussion came to be, and what they both learned from the process!Ousterhout/Martin Discussion: https://github.com/johnousterhout/aposd-vs-clean-code-- Books Mentioned in this Episode --Note: As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.----------------------------------------------------------A Philosophy of Software Design by John Ousterhouthttps://amzn.to/3XCPliz (Paid Link)Clean Code by Robert Martinhttps://amzn.to/4iJ4Ttq (Paid Link)Clean Coder, The: A Code of Conduct for Professional Programmers by Robert C. Martin https://amzn.to/3E9zf9l (Paid Link)We, Programmers: A Chronicle of Coders from Ada to AI by Robert Martinhttps://amzn.to/42aW194 (Paid Link)Design Patterns: Elements of Reusable Object-Oriented Software by Erich Gamma, Richard Helm, Ralph Johnson, John Vlissideshttps://amzn.to/4hRbYa3 (Paid Link)Structured Analysis and System Specification by Tom DeMarco, P. J. Plaugerhttps://amzn.to/3E0Y7QD (Paid Link)Practical Guide to Structured Systems Design by Meilir Page-Joneshttps://amzn.to/4hNd8mV (Paid Link)Design by Contract: By Example First Edition by Richard Mitchell, Jim McKim, Bertrand Meyerhttps://amzn.to/4i4X6VW (Paid Link)Structured Programming by Edsger Wybe Dijkstra, C. A. R. Hoare, Ole-Johan Dahlhttps://amzn.to/42fXfzX (Paid Link)On the Criteria To Be Used in Decomposing Systems into Modules by D.L. Parnashttps://wstomv.win.tue.nl/edu/2ip30/references/criteria_for_modularization.pdf----------------00:00 Intro03:11 Origin of the debate06:52 Motivation for the debate11:35 How did you settle on the terms of the debate?14:30 Overcoming Self-Doubt and Engaging with others20:06 Influences in Developing Design Aesthetics28:45 Taking time for Deep Thinking vs Shallow thinking33:58 Writing Code and Reducing Cognative Load39:05 Encouraging healthy debate42:38 Coding Style, Retirement, and what’s next49:40 Final Thoughts----------------Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5kj6DLCEWR5nHShlSYJI5LApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/book-overflow/id1745257325X: https://x.com/bookoverflowpodCarter on X: https://x.com/cartermorganNathan's Functionally Imperative: www.functionallyimperative.com----------------Book Overflow is a podcast for software engineers, by software engineers dedicated to improving our craft by reading the best technical books in the world. Join Carter Morgan and Nathan Toups as they read and discuss a new technical book each week!The full book schedule and links to every major podcast player can be found at https://www.bookoverflow.io
Is Worse Better? - Worse is Better by Richard P. Gabriel
This week Carter and Nathan take a break from books and discuss the the seminal Worse is Better essays by Richard P. Gabriel. Join them as they how Unix and C were once perceived, tradeoffs in software design, and whether or not worse is truly better!-- Books Mentioned in this Episode --Note: As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.----------------------------------------------------------Worse is Betterhttps://www.dreamsongs.com/WorseIsBetter.htmlRise of Worse is Betterhttps://www.dreamsongs.com/RiseOfWorseIsBetter.html----------------00:00 Intro01:37 About the Essays06:18 Thoughts on the Essays15:48 "the right thing" vs "worse is better" or MIT vs New Jersey39:59 Usefulness: Why worse beats better49:41 when worse is worse57:31 Final Thoughts----------------Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5kj6DLCEWR5nHShlSYJI5LApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/book-overflow/id1745257325X: https://x.com/bookoverflowpodCarter on X: https://x.com/cartermorganNathan's Functionally Imperative: www.functionallyimperative.com----------------Book Overflow is a podcast for software engineers, by software engineers dedicated to improving our craft by reading the best technical books in the world. Join Carter Morgan and Nathan Toups as they read and discuss a new technical book each week!The full book schedule and links to every major podcast player can be found at https://www.bookoverflow.io
Gergely Orosz Reflects on The Software Engineer's Guidebook
In this episode, Gergely Orosz joins Carter and Nathan to discuss his book The Software Engineer's Guidebook. Join them as Gergely reflects on the differences between writing a book and The Pragmatic Engineer newsletter, the importance of professional networks, and the state of the hiring market today!https://www.pragmaticengineer.com/-- Books Mentioned in this Episode --Note: As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.----------------------------------------------------------The Software Engineer's Guidebookhttps://amzn.to/41AxMAL (Paid Link)Thinking in Systems by Donella H. Meadows https://amzn.to/4kGtmkI (Paid Link)Tidy First?: A Personal Exercise in Empirical Software Design by Kent Beckhttps://amzn.to/4bHoNCv (Paid Link)Become an Effective Software Engineering Manager: How to Be the Leader Your Development Team Needs by Dr. James Stanierhttps://amzn.to/4kCzvhD (Paid Link)The Engineering Executive's Primer: Impactful Technical Leadership by Will Larsonhttps://amzn.to/4hpRDIS (Paid Link)----------------00:00 Intro02:11 What inspired you to write the book?08:46 Gaining the Vocabulary and learning on your own13:45 Writing a Newsletter vs Writing a Book22:55 Taking initiative and Embracing Curiosity35:30 Working Remotely and Cultivating Connections41:13 Periodic Effort: Stretching, Executing, and Coasting46:41 Navigating Company Cultures50:05 The Future of Interviews: AI Cheating and the end of the Remote Interviews58:33 How the job market has changed01:05:10 Closing Thoughts Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5kj6DLCEWR5nHShlSYJI5LApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/book-overflow/id1745257325X: https://x.com/bookoverflowpodCarter on X: https://x.com/cartermorganNathan's Functionally Imperative: www.functionallyimperative.com----------------Book Overflow is a podcast for software engineers, by software engineers dedicated to improving our craft by reading the best technical books in the world. Join Carter Morgan and Nathan Toups as they read and discuss a new technical book each week!The full book schedule and links to every major podcast player can be found at https://www.bookoverflow.io
More on System Design Interviews - System Design Interview by Alex Xu
This week Carter and Nathan discuss the second half of System Design Interview by Alex Xu. Join them as they discuss how system design interviews prepare you for daily work, what system design questions they've been asked in the past, and their thoughts on Apple Intelligence!Byte Byte Go: https://bytebytego.com/-- Books Mentioned in this Episode --Note: As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.----------------------------------------------------------System Design Interview by Alex Xuhttps://amzn.to/4iUR9vg (paid link)----- 00:00 Intro03:30 Thoughts on the Book14:01 Nathan's Favorite Case Study and Thoughts on Take-Home Problems21:23 non sequitur: Applying for Jobs, Recruiters, and Compensation36:03 non sequitur: roasting Apple on how bad Siri is right now.41:57 Carter's favorite case study and New books for the backlog49:07 Final Thoughts----------------Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5kj6DLCEWR5nHShlSYJI5LApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/book-overflow/id1745257325X: https://x.com/bookoverflowpodCarter on X: https://x.com/cartermorganNathan's Functionally Imperative: www.functionallyimperative.com----------------Book Overflow is a podcast for software engineers, by software engineers dedicated to improving our craft by reading the best technical books in the world. Join Carter Morgan and Nathan Toups as they read and discuss a new technical book each week!The full book schedule and links to every major podcast player can be found at https://www.bookoverflow.io
Carson Gross (Creator of HTMX) Reflects on Hypermedia Systems
In this episode, Carson Gross joins Carter and Nathan to discuss his book Hypermedia Systems Join them as Carson reflects on the process of publishing the book, the development of HTMX, and how to deal with setbacks!John Ousterhout and Bob Martin Conversationhttps://github.com/johnousterhout/aposd-vs-clean-codeFixi.js (a new project from Carson Gross)https://github.com/bigskysoftware/fixiTriptych - New Attributes for HTMLhttps://github.com/alexpetros/triptychHTMXhttps://htmx.org/-- Books Mentioned in this Episode --Note: As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.----------------------------------------------------------Hypermedia Systemshttps://amzn.to/4iou43T (Paid Link)Philosophy of Software Design by John Ousterhouthttps://amzn.to/4bEVMHp (Paid Link)The Master and Margarita: 50th-Anniversary Edition by Mikhail Bulgakovhttps://amzn.to/3R1pzR3 (Paid Link)Worse is Better (essay)https://www.dreamsongs.com/WorseIsBetter.htmlNo Silver Bullethttps://worrydream.com/refs/Brooks_1986_-_No_Silver_Bullet.pdf----------------00:00 Intro01:47 What Inspired you to write Hypermedia Systems07:37 Challenging Assumptions, Hypermedia, Javascript, and Worse is Better13:51 Roy Fielding, REST, HATEOAS and mispronouncing things.16:15 What is the most surprising outcome of writing Hypermedia Systems?19:42 Creating fixi.js28:32 Discussing Progressive Enhancement, Triptych, and Browser Standards35:40 Dealing with Setbacks and Success41:01 No Silver Bullet, and the Ousterhout and Martin debate50:00 What if No HTMX? Hypercard56:11 Tool chains, debuggers, and developer expectations01:01:29 Final Thoughts----------------Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5kj6DLCEWR5nHShlSYJI5LApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/book-overflow/id1745257325X: https://x.com/bookoverflowpodCarter on X: https://x.com/cartermorganNathan's Functionally Imperative: www.functionallyimperative.com----------------Book Overflow is a podcast for software engineers, by software engineers dedicated to improving our craft by reading the best technical books in the world. Join Carter Morgan and Nathan Toups as they read and discuss a new technical book each week!The full book schedule and links to every major podcast player can be found at https://www.bookoverflow.io
Acing the System Design Interview - System Design Interview by Alex Xu
This week Carter and Nathan discuss the first half of System Design Interview by Alex Xu. Join them as they discuss Alex's excellent newsletter Byte Byte Go, how systems design interviews reflect actual jobs, and what tips and tricks Alex offers to ace your interviews!Byte Byte Go: https://bytebytego.com/-- Books Mentioned in this Episode --Note: As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.----------------------------------------------------------System Design Interview – An insider's guide by Alex Xu https://amzn.to/3EXFYUa (paid link)Team Topologies by Matthew Skelton and Manuel Paishttps://amzn.to/4kgfH3F (paid link)----------------00:00 Intro01:33 About the Book03:08 Thoughts on the Book11:57 What is a Systems Design Interview?22:15 Why focus on Systems Design Interview?27:26 Our Experience with System Design Interviews36:09 Strategies, Approach, and Expertise40:20 Importance of Back of the Envelope Calculations45:39 Learning through building57:02 Final Thoughts----------------Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5kj6DLCEWR5nHShlSYJI5LApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/book-overflow/id1745257325X: https://x.com/bookoverflowpodCarter on X: https://x.com/cartermorganNathan's Functionally Imperative: www.functionallyimperative.com----------------Book Overflow is a podcast for software engineers, by software engineers dedicated to improving our craft by reading the best technical books in the world. Join Carter Morgan and Nathan Toups as they read and discuss a new technical book each week!The full book schedule and links to every major podcast player can be found at https://www.bookoverflow.io
Evolving Your Software Teams - Team Topologies by Matthew Skelton & Manuel Pais
In this episode of Book Overflow, Carter and Nathan discuss the second half of Team Topologies by Matthew Skelton and Manuel Pais. Join them as they discuss how teams evolve, when you can tell a team might be reaching its breaking point, and what a company needs beyond the team topologies!-- Books Mentioned in this Episode --Note: As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.----------------------------------------------------------Team Topologies by Matthew Skelton and Manuel Paishttps://amzn.to/4kgfH3F (paid link)----------------00:00 Intro01:26 About the Book03:10 Thoughts on the Book09:20 Team Interaction Modes41:01 Changing Team Structures01:05:04 Final Thoughts----------------Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5kj6DLCEWR5nHShlSYJI5LApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/book-overflow/id1745257325X: https://x.com/bookoverflowpodCarter on X: https://x.com/cartermorganNathan's Functionally Imperative: www.functionallyimperative.com----------------Book Overflow is a podcast for software engineers, by software engineers dedicated to improving our craft by reading the best technical books in the world. Join Carter Morgan and Nathan Toups as they read and discuss a new technical book each week!The full book schedule and links to every major podcast player can be found at https://www.bookoverflow.io
Building Effective Teams - Team Topologies by Matthew Skelton & Manuel Pais
In this episode of Book Overflow, Carter and Nathan discuss the first half of Team Topologies by Matthew Skelton and Manuel Pais. Join them as they discuss the four main types of teams, what teams they've worked on in the past, remote work, and more!-- Books Mentioned in this Episode --Note: As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.----------------------------------------------------------Team Topologies by Matthew Skelton and Manuel Paishttps://amzn.to/4kgfH3F (paid link)----------------Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5kj6DLCEWR5nHShlSYJI5LApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/book-overflow/id1745257325X: https://x.com/bookoverflowpodCarter on X: https://x.com/cartermorganNathan's Functionally Imperative: www.functionallyimperative.com----------------Book Overflow is a podcast for software engineers, by software engineers dedicated to improving our craft by reading the best technical books in the world. Join Carter Morgan and Nathan Toups as they read and discuss a new technical book each week!The full book schedule and links to every major podcast player can be found at https://www.bookoverflow.io
Is HTMX Right For You? - Hypermedia Systems by Gross, Stepinski, & Akşimşek
In this episode of Book Overflow, Carter and Nathan discuss the back half of Hypermedia Systems by Carson Gross, Adam Stepinski, and Deniz Akşimşek. Join them as they discuss the pros and cons of HTMX, whether or not you should choose it over a more popular framework like React, and more!-- Books Mentioned in this Episode --Note: As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.----------------------------------------------------------Hypermedia Systems by Carson Gross, Adam Stepinski, and Deniz Akşimşekhttps://amzn.to/3C503GQ (https://amzn.to/4aDjFyD)----------------Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5kj6DLCEWR5nHShlSYJI5LApple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/book-overflow/id1745257325X: https://x.com/bookoverflowpodCarter on X: https://x.com/cartermorganNathan's Functionally Imperative: www.functionallyimperative.com----------------Book Overflow is a podcast for software engineers, by software engineers dedicated to improving our craft by reading the best technical books in the world. Join Carter Morgan and Nathan Toups as they read and discuss a new technical book each week!The full book schedule and links to every major podcast player can be found at https://www.bookoverflow.io
Make Web 1.0 Great Again! - Hypermedia Systems by Gross, Stepinski, & Akşimşek
In this episode of Book Overflow, Carter and Nathan discuss the first 200 pages of Hypermedia Systems by Carson Gross, Adam Stepinski, and Deniz Akşimşek. Join them as they discuss HTMX, an alternative to modern JavaScript front-end frameworks, and the philosophies that made Web 1.0 so powerful! -- Books Mentioned in this Episode -- Note: As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases. ---------------------------------------------------------- Hypermedia Systems by Carson Gross, Adam Stepinski, and Deniz Akşimşek https://amzn.to/3C503GQ (https://amzn.to/4aDjFyD) ---------------- Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5kj6DLCEWR5nHShlSYJI5L Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/book-overflow/id1745257325 X: https://x.com/bookoverflowpod Carter on X: https://x.com/cartermorgan Nathan's Functionally Imperative: www.functionallyimperative.com ---------------- Book Overflow is a podcast for software engineers, by software engineers dedicated to improving our craft by reading the best technical books in the world. Join Carter Morgan and Nathan Toups as they read and discuss a new technical book each week! The full book schedule and links to every major podcast player can be found at https://www.bookoverflow.io
Kent Beck Reflects on Tidy First?
In this special episode of Book Overflow, Kent Beck joins Carter and Nathan to discuss his book Tidy First? Join them as Kent reflects on the artistry of programming design, the importance of optionality, and how the Time Value of Money applies to software engineering! -- Books Mentioned in this Episode -- Note: As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases. ---------------------------------------------------------- Tidy First? https://amzn.to/4atHiKa (Paid Link) ---------------- Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5kj6DLCEWR5nHShlSYJI5L Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/book-overflow/id1745257325 X: https://x.com/bookoverflowpod Carter on X: https://x.com/cartermorgan Nathan's Functionally Imperative: www.functionallyimperative.com ---------------- Book Overflow is a podcast for software engineers, by software engineers dedicated to improving our craft by reading the best technical books in the world. Join Carter Morgan and Nathan Toups as they read and discuss a new technical book each week! The full book schedule and links to every major podcast player can be found at https://www.bookoverflow.io
Project Leadership & Understanding the Business - The Software Engineer's Guidebook by Gergely Orosz
In this episode of Book Overflow, Carter and Nathan discuss the second half of The Software Engineer's Guidebook by Gergely Orosz. Join them as they discuss work/life balance, project management, and which computer science subreddits to avoid! (We're about 95% sure that Carter recorded with the wrong microphone accidentally, so his audio is a little rough this episode. Sorry!) -- Books Mentioned in this Episode -- Note: As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases. ---------------------------------------------------------- The Software Engineer's Guidebook by Gergely Orosz https://amzn.to/3C503GQ (paid link) ---------------- Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5kj6DLCEWR5nHShlSYJI5L Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/book-overflow/id1745257325 X: https://x.com/bookoverflowpod Carter on X: https://x.com/cartermorgan Nathan's Functionally Imperative: www.functionallyimperative.com ---------------- Book Overflow is a podcast for software engineers, by software engineers dedicated to improving our craft by reading the best technical books in the world. Join Carter Morgan and Nathan Toups as they read and discuss a new technical book each week! The full book schedule and links to every major podcast player can be found at https://www.bookoverflow.io
Owning Your Career - The Software Engineer's Guidebook by Gergely Orosz
In this episode of Book Overflow, Carter and Nathan discuss The Software Engineer's Guidebook by Gergely Orosz. Join them as they discuss software engineering compensation, how to ace your performance reviews, and what "getting things done" means! -- Books Mentioned in this Episode -- Note: As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases. ---------------------------------------------------------- The Software Engineer's Guidebook by Gergely Orosz https://amzn.to/3C503GQ (paid link) ---------------- Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5kj6DLCEWR5nHShlSYJI5L Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/book-overflow/id1745257325 X: https://x.com/bookoverflowpod Carter on X: https://x.com/cartermorgan Nathan's Functionally Imperative: www.functionallyimperative.com ---------------- Book Overflow is a podcast for software engineers, by software engineers dedicated to improving our craft by reading the best technical books in the world. Join Carter Morgan and Nathan Toups as they read and discuss a new technical book each week! The full book schedule and links to every major podcast player can be found at https://www.bookoverflow.io