Its de facto capital is falling. Its territory has shriveled to a handful of outposts. Its surviving leaders are on the run, and its fighters are surrendering. Is the Islamic State losing its war, or starting a new one? Guests: Rod Nordland, The Times’s bureau chief in Kabul, Afghanistan; Rukmini Callimachi, who covers terrorism and the Islamic State. For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.